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Dual Mecha for high resolution outdoor HDRI spherical pano capturing for Image-based lighting (IBL).

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  • Dual Mecha for high resolution outdoor HDRI spherical pano capturing for Image-based lighting (IBL).

    Hello. I'm "early adopter" of Dual Mecha, but was never be able use it yet in my works due to limits in controlling system.

    At first, lets explain difference in high resolution outdoor HDRI capturing process for Image-based lighting (IBL) comparing to tonemapped HDRIs.

    • What the difference between HDRI spherical pano and Spherical pano for IBL?
    HDRI for IBL required capture ALL scene dynamic range (daylight scene ~25-30EV night scenes up to 34~36) and make this correctly (less than 3EV steps.)
    For Pano tours when you will watch panos as tonemapped images, you can ignore shadows or lights. In HDRIs for IBL you must capture all details from sun spot or bright light to details in shadows.
    When tonemapped "HDRI" pano can required only 3-5 brackets, IBL HDRI can required 7-9-11 and even more brackets. Depend on camera from 1/8000sec to 20sec shutter speed.
    So to capture every camera orientation can required up to 45sec~1min.

    Now let's look into longest exposure 10-20 sec brackets. If we thinking about outdoor HDRIs we always have deal with people and cars that in some cases.
    For example to capture Clear HDRI of night Kyoto Gion street. You will spend most of time to capture this last brackets. in some orientation where you can see far to the street from 10x 20sec shots 9x shots any later couples will walk through you or Taxi will pass. (I know someone can recommend later time, but later night most of signs can be shutdown. And you will lost some nice lights.)

    So total time to capture HDRI pano like this (tonamapped) https://roundme.com/tour/279974/view/867579/ was about 30minutes. Where two or three orientations i was reshot for 5-10 times.

    For 12mm lens on APS-C Sony this is about 14-16 poses.


    As i see fully automatic HDRI capturing process is not possible with Mecha.
    Best way to make Mecha usable for that spherical panos is semi-manual process:

    When controlling software have "Orientation presets" something similar to:
    top row [1] [2] [3] [4]
    center row [1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6]
    bottom row [1] [2] [3] [4]

    and optional Auto or Manual shutter triggering.
    Where user can press to any of this buttons and Mecha will set to it. (optional will be great to change color on buttons already pressed once).

    This can be useful for any outdoor capturing process. As soon as in most cases decision on capturing order can be made only on location and based on many circumstances.
    And in random capturing order it possible to capture almost whole pano, and wait when last orientations will be ready (like Taxi will drive away, or Sun go out from small cloud).

    I guess current Mecha firmware do not have this features.

    And before it will, i have question is this possible and how i can setup presets
    to only rotate Mecha both rotators to +30 -30, +60, -60 etc.

    For example if my shooting pattern is:
    4+6+4 or 5+6+5
    i want setup:
    2 vertical rotation: [+55] and [-55] that will allow me quickly rotate up or down.
    and Horisontal [+60] [-60] [+120] [-120] (in case 5x [+72] [-72] degree.


    And want have access from one tab, without longer switching between 192.168.8.1 and 192.168.8.100 tabs on smartphone.
    I hope this is possible in latest firmware?

    Thank you.

  • #2
    I'll try to respond to the questions, could be in several posts

    About shooting pattern

    --------------------8<---------------

    C2E_02090..91
    Added a simple form of scripting to specify a spherical panorama.
    e.g. for 50mm on FF a panorama can be covered by
    1 row at 75 deg, made of 5 shots
    1 row at 50 deg, made of 11 shots
    1 row at 25 deg, made of 16 shots
    1 row at 0 deg, made of 17 shots
    1 row at -25 deg, made of 16 shots
    1 row at -50 deg, made of 11 shots
    1 row at -75 deg, made of 5 shots
    this can be now scripted as
    SL,75x5,50x11,25x16,0x17,-25x16,-50x11,-75x5
    SL stands for Start (and end) in Level position
    SP, or SR can be used instead for Parked or Raised positions.
    If is need for Zenith or Nadir shot, they need to be added after SL,
    e.g. SL,Z,N, or SL,ZZ,NN, for one or two photos at 90 deg apart.
    e.g. SL,N,Z,75x5,50x11,25x16,0x17,-25x16,-50x11,-75x5

    --------------------8<---------------

    The pause button of UI will pause/unpause the scripting

    The script can have pause in it
    e.g, this will pause just before the row at 0 deg tilt

    SL,75x5,50x11,25x16,P0x17,-25x16,-50x11,-75x5

    During the pause some extra shoots can be taken.
    1. Mecha it possible.
    2. Mecha it easy.
    3. Mecha team up.

    4. ..

    Comment


    • #3
      --------8<--------------

      When controlling software have "Orientation presets" something similar to:
      top row [1] [2] [3] [4]
      center row [1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6]
      bottom row [1] [2] [3] [4]

      --------8<-------------
      I think this will be covered with this script
      SL,45x4,0x6,-45x4

      assumed top and bottom rows at +-45 deg. tilt

      if Nadir and Zenith are needed
      SL,N,Z,45x4,0x6,-45x4
      or
      SL,NN,ZZ,45x4,0x6,-45x4

      1. Mecha it possible.
      2. Mecha it easy.
      3. Mecha team up.

      4. ..

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by DorinDXN View Post
        --------8<--------------

        When controlling software have "Orientation presets" something similar to:
        top row [1] [2] [3] [4]
        center row [1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6]
        bottom row [1] [2] [3] [4]

        --------8<-------------
        I think this will be covered with this script
        SL,45x4,0x6,-45x4

        assumed top and bottom rows at +-45 deg. tilt

        if Nadir and Zenith are needed
        SL,N,Z,45x4,0x6,-45x4
        or
        SL,NN,ZZ,45x4,0x6,-45x4
        Main idea is "random" access to specific orientation.

        For example in Kyoto i shot all top and all bottom loops, and 3 from 6th poses in central loop. And spent almost 30 minutes to capture last 3 orientations.

        Comment


        • #5
          That will be covered in the upcoming posts.
          1. Mecha it possible.
          2. Mecha it easy.
          3. Mecha team up.

          4. ..

          Comment


          • #6
            DorinDXN, sorry.

            But not so clear how script can be used to Rotate Only (not shoot) Mecha in specific angle?

            I just want rotate mecha to +60H and press Shoot button or even press on camera. Next again +60H and again. Than if i see i need change to top press +55V and may be twice -60H and only after that shoot.

            Comment


            • #7
              There is WIP for arbitrary positions that will make more easy than is in current, a bit of delay couldn't managed to add raw interface this week I'm developing in sinch for both DUAL combo and two axis MECHA and the raw interface will be for both, but a bit delyaed.

              Originally posted by DorinDXN View Post
              I intended to add a way to go quickly to an arbitrary position within the script but turn out to be more easy and safe to add it after the RAW interface will be introduced this week.
              I'll continue with presets to buttons, just to search where the info was posted here

              ------------------------8<------------------

              And before it will, i have question is this possible and how i can setup presets
              to only rotate Mecha both rotators to +30 -30, +60, -60 etc.

              -----------------------8<------------------
              1. Mecha it possible.
              2. Mecha it easy.
              3. Mecha team up.

              4. ..

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by shaman View Post
                DorinDXN, sorry.

                But not so clear how script can be used to Rotate Only (not shoot) Mecha in specific angle?

                I just want rotate mecha to +60H and press Shoot button or even press on camera. Next again +60H and again. Than if i see i need change to top press +55V and may be twice -60H and only after that shoot.
                Yes, about that I'm searching and re-post here, will take just a bit..
                1. Mecha it possible.
                2. Mecha it easy.
                3. Mecha team up.

                4. ..

                Comment


                • #9
                  Posted elsewhere

                  -------------8<---------------------------

                  say for V MECHA you can have set
                  [1 Shots] [0 IMG] [90°] [x1] [Wait] for V MECHA to move up and down with exactly 90° or you can use the slider for a particular move in degrees.
                  you can save the preset with [Save 1]
                  now every time you push the button [1] then [<] for move in one direction or [1] then [>] to move in the other with exact 90°,
                  for battery changes, so on, you need to use V MECHA's buttons, of course.

                  The settings in V MECHA will not affect the DAC presets from H MECHA so you'll program both MECHA from H, only use V MECHA buttons to rotate V MECHA up or down with 90° using only the button [1] [<] or [V],
                  in the same way you can save 180 deg movement on button 2, or even say 120 deg if that makes more easy to change the battery, so on,

                  As result, you may never need to access V MECHA's UI on field.

                  -------------8<------------------------------

                  this way can be used for both MECHA,

                  also a preset which start in name with 0 automatically has a power code associated, say
                  the preset with the name

                  01 Jump 45 --- can be launched with 01< or 01> 0 is the power button
                  02 Jump 90 - // - 02> or 02<
                  03 Jump 120 - // - 03> or 03<
                  012 Rotate 180 - // - 012> or 012<
                  if they have set [0 IMG] there will be no photo taken, only the move will be performed,
                  also the script can change the [0 IMG] to [3 IMG] so is possible to start only with a move automatically pause in position then continue with shooting

                  and use the presets with power codes for complete automated sequence which can have pause at some e point.
                  from pause the panorama can advance with either pause or [>] button of MECHA

                  or you can have these arbitrary rotations
                  on simple 1, 2 or 3 button in which case as regular 1> or 1< or 2>... will launch it.

                  I'll post more, not sure how much today, but will be more..

                  1. Mecha it possible.
                  2. Mecha it easy.
                  3. Mecha team up.

                  4. ..

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by shaman View Post

                    Main idea is "random" access to specific orientation.

                    For example in Kyoto i shot all top and all bottom loops, and 3 from 6th poses in central loop. And spent almost 30 minutes to capture last 3 orientations.
                    You're right, I thought a bit and came to conclusion that adding those quick "buttons" for particular orientations will be the best, I'll add it ASAP right after the introducing of the raw interface.

                    best reagrds,
                    Dorin
                    1. Mecha it possible.
                    2. Mecha it easy.
                    3. Mecha team up.

                    4. ..

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      DorinDXN, sorry, anything changed since 18th May?

                      How can i define Presets for use in GUI:
                      1) Vertical Rotate +55
                      2) Vertical Rotate -55
                      3) Horizontal Rotate: +60
                      4) Horizontal Rotate: -60
                      5) Horizontal Rotate: +72
                      6) Horizontal Rotate: -72
                      7) Vertical Rotate +90
                      8) Vertical Rotate -90

                      And how i can quickly access to this presets and start such preset rotations?

                      I still not see any way to use Mecha without this 😰

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by shaman View Post
                        DorinDXN, sorry, anything changed since 18th May?
                        Yes, about 25 FW updates since then

                        Originally posted by shaman View Post
                        How can i define Presets for use in GUI:
                        1) Vertical Rotate +55
                        2) Vertical Rotate -55
                        3) Horizontal Rotate: +60
                        4) Horizontal Rotate: -60
                        5) Horizontal Rotate: +72
                        6) Horizontal Rotate: -72
                        7) Vertical Rotate +90
                        8) Vertical Rotate -90

                        And how i can quickly access to this presets and start such preset rotations?

                        I still not see any way to use Mecha without this 😰
                        Please update MECHAs they should update to C1E_02117

                        then in /config of each MECHA, there you can set three intervals


                        Click image for larger version

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                        Interval 1 can be launched by pressing [>] then quick [1] or [<] then quick [1] for other direction
                        Interval 2 can be launched by pressing [>] then quick [2] or [<] then quick [2] for other direction
                        Interval 3 can be launched by pressing [>] then quick [3] or [<] then quick [3] for other direction

                        then [Apply]

                        About UI there are several ways to achieve that

                        one way
                        in /row page of MECHA-H-DAC you can use scripted for presets

                        [0 IMG]
                        S=0,=55 will rotate V MECHA up 55 deg.
                        while
                        S=0,=-55 will rotate V MECHA down 55 deg.

                        S=0,=_60 rotate H MECHA to right 60 deg.
                        S=0,=_-60 rotate H MECHA to left 60 deg.

                        you can set these presets then save it with names starting with numbers

                        like
                        0551 the preset for 55 up
                        0552 the preset for 55 down
                        0601 the preset for 60 to right
                        0602 the preset for 60 to left
                        so on

                        then bookmark these links on your home screen on your phone
                        http://192.168.8.1/do?p=0551
                        http://192.168.8.1/do?p=0552
                        http://192.168.8.1/do?p=0601
                        http://192.168.8.1/do?p=0602
                        so on
                        each link will execute a particular preset thus rotate the MECHAs as you want.
                        1. Mecha it possible.
                        2. Mecha it easy.
                        3. Mecha team up.

                        4. ..

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          If the above seems complicated, just tell me, I'll produce a simpler example, but not right now, I must finish something with high priority today.
                          1. Mecha it possible.
                          2. Mecha it easy.
                          3. Mecha team up.

                          4. ..

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by DorinDXN View Post
                            If the above seems complicated, just tell me, I'll produce a simpler example, but not right now, I must finish something with high priority today.
                            Not so clear about defining, saving and using preset.

                            Script input in [wait][No repeat] ->[Scripted] <- ?

                            [0 IMG] in script text or in
                            [0 IMG][AF ***][W***] ?


                            To start script from Gui, not from link (to check if it work correctly), how i can do this?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Yes, script input in [wait][No repeat] ->[Scripted] <- then the text box below
                              0 IMG in [0 IMG][AF ***][W***] not in script

                              To start the preset with script from GUI, select [1 Shots] then [RIGHT]

                              1. Mecha it possible.
                              2. Mecha it easy.
                              3. Mecha team up.

                              4. ..

                              Comment

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